Shaahayda Rizvi
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Yes indeed the new COHO layout is very attractive and easy to navigate. Thank you Lynn for the reference to Joe’s audio lecture on “Personal Myth”. Although, I love the entire recording, the reinventing our childhood symbols is my favorite. Particularly enjoyable was the section on Jung uncovering his childhood symbols, and from then forward, his dream world became rich and the images that came through his dreams, then found their way into his psyche, doors opened for him, he met new friends, and scholars. I especially loved the way he described Freud’s interpretation of dreams (ha ha) from waist downward, and neglects the neck upward part of our biology!!
I need to find a way to work with my childhood symbols. Realization a bit too late because skipping rope is no longer that easy or that much fun!
Shaheda
Dear Dr. Slattery,
Thank you so very much for your response. I posted my comments/questions in a private message to you. Reason being that I was not sure whether or not I could share parts of the presentation in a public forum.
Also, I mentioned in another thread the discussion on the personal myth we had in the Q&A session. The question asked in your presentation was how do we know that a myth is dying and a new one is birthing. A jcf member, SidianMSJones asked for a link to your presentation. I am not able to answer that question.
Also, I listened to Joe’s lecture on personal mythology where he talks about the REACTIVIATION of our childhood symbols. How very important that is to one’s myth. Dennis thank you so much for your time, and so if you have a minute and you spot my questions in your private messenger, and if you feel it’s ok to elaborate upon the questions right here, I’ll be grateful.
Shaheda (in gratitude)
Hello James,
Thanks for pointing me to Pathways to Bliss. I love this book and was busy flipping through other chapters, “Necessity of Rites” “Myth and the Self” “Society and the Symbol”. There is so much to learn from every page of this book and all of Joe’s books.
In Chapter “The Self as Hero”, pg. 117 – 119: What I enjoyed reading were the three main realization symbols that Joe discusses, 1. the reconciliation with the animus and anima 2. the atonement with the father and 3. the realization of oneself. The third one is the surrender of one’s identification with forms – our physical and mental forms.
Would you say James that such a journey where one meets these symbols reminds one of a few of Charles Dicken’s characters? In Christmas Carols, there are four stages to Scrooge’s journey. He is becoming more aware of his character and with each stage, another dimension opens up. Atonement comes with losing his attachments to all that he was chained to – yes he must untie the knots that chained him to the money boxes forged during his lifetime of greed. The way to the father is through surrender. His last stage is when he awakens a changed man, surrendering to his greed and attachments.
On the subject of personal myths, I have also been listening to Joe’s lecture (as Lynn thoughtfully drew my attention) on the subject, where he discusses Jung’s search of his personal myth. How turning towards his childhood symbols, and incorporating them, “REACTIVATION OF SYMBOLS” says Joe, is what begins to define his personal myth. His dream world becomes intensely rich, there are dream images that he begins to draw and paint and soon, scholars come into his life and on and on.
Have you reactivated your childhood symbols James? I have not, only because it’s difficult to do at this stage in life. Things I enjoyed when my mother said. ‘go out and play’, things that made me lose track of time, were two:
1. Skipping Rope for hours and hours. 2. Swinging on a swing….Now thinking of rope and swinging reminds me of Oscar Wilde’s poem, “The Ballad of Reading Gaol” (That’s my association with these symbols) And my personal myth might be somewhere in between…Who knows?
Also, what stories come to mind when you read the following, “In stories of atonement with the father, the woman either becomes the guide or the seductress..”
Shaheda
Thank you Lynn. I just downloaded the lecture, and hope to contribute some more, if I can. Thank you all for the awesome contributions. So much to learn and absorb just on this topic.
Thank you Stephen, ” I suspect those who dismiss “personal myth” are really expressing their discomfort with popular misunderstandings of what Campbell means (much the same as Jordan Peterson’s antipathy toward the idea of “following your bliss” – what he describes isn’t how Joe uses the term, but how some lazy thinkers believe about it; turns out he reinforces those misconceptions, and is a bit of a lazy thinker himself, as he too misunderstood Campbell on this point).”
Stephen: Dennis too discussed personal myth in his presentation. (I am hoping that my recollection is not faulty) Question was asked how do you know that a myth (macro level) is dying, and can one say the same about a personal myth (micro level)? So the discussion on Mythology of Belief spilled into other areas of personal myths.
Thank you Marianne for your thought provoking and wonderful contribution. “Perhaps in this thread we could take some time to unravel then list differentiations we can make in whatever ways we each do so–or discuss what this concept of differentiation means to us and how it plays out in each our lives and possibly then examine too how these could differ from the collective–and apply this to our personal myths (to include our dreams, I suggest).” Would love to see this thread unravel in all directions.
SidianMSJones, “Do you happen to have a link to that Dennis Slattery presentation you mentioned?” No I don’t, and it’s best that Dennis explore and elaborate this. I am afraid of misstating because I didn’t write or record the session.
And James, I am still working on a response to your post. Got my book by my side, I’ll write back tonight.
Greetings Sidian MSJones.
Sidian wrote, “The topic is fascinating though as it unlocks a slew of highly metaphorical information about ourselves: when have you taken on the role of the warrior? In what ways have you been searching for the Holy Grail? Have you ever unknowingly acted out the myth of the hoarding dragon?
Is anyone else here interested in Personal Mythology?
I am Sidian, very much so, and as Stephen wrote, “Investigating the subjective contents which are the products of unconscious processes . . . to explore the manifestations of the unconscious” (again borrowing from Jung’s description of his personal myth) can be uncomfortable and emotionally wrenching – not at all the “happy happy joy joy” misunderstanding some critics have of what they think Campbell means by personal mythology.”
That’s it, Sidian, exploring my personal myth is not “happy happy joy joy’ for me, and sometimes I am not sure whether I am looking at my personal myth from “inside looking out” or “outside looking in”. But it’s a friend’s story/myth that had me quite taken. Talk about searching the “Holy Grail” — To me it appeared a myth of “unconditional love”
No matter how difficult, no matter how trying, she was on the side of “unconditional love”. Then one day, Joe Campbell’s quote freed her from her ‘old personal myth’, and she had a soft landing into a ‘new personal myth’. By the way, I was recently acquainted with this term ‘old personal myth’ vs. ‘new personal myth’ through Prof. Dennis Slattery’s presentation called “Belief as Myth”. A fascinating presentation, where in the Q&A session he reflected on a few questions, one being, ‘how do we know that we have come to the end of one myth, and need to move onto a next one?” But I digress, because my intention here is to share the old myth story vs. the new myth story.
Here is a brief glimpse, (without names)
Her father was a banker, and her mother a fixer of all things, from furniture to linen, from doors and window sills and all others in between. Her mother could fix furniture like none other in business. This I know because I now own three hand-polished chairs from Kirkland Lake, hand scrubbed, re-polished and hand stained to a silky satin finish by her mother.
By and by, as she got older, she began to question the culture of the place, the place of women, especially smart women in it. She observed the condition of the mine-workers, working for pittance, in the gold mines owned by Mr. Oaks. Their plight is well illustrated in this 2002 article,
“An accident in a mine is usually sudden. Hard rock, steel and blasting powder are not considerate of soft flesh and brittle bone. Death in most cases is gruesome, lonely, painful, bloody or suffocating. Death in a mine is not gentle.”[i]
As she grew, so did her longing to fix the condition of the mine workers around her. She took it upon herself to talk to the ladies, and make them question their despondent state and misery.
In school, she wrote fascinating stories, and perhaps poetry too. Her writings were rich with words that she had collected and sewn together for a dramatic effect on listeners and especially her teachers. She thought of the many widows, left behind, and the cruel and most ugly treatment delivered to their families.
The teachers never expected her to write so well, so instead of empowering her with more challenging work, they politely hid their admiration in a way that was natural to them. And on her side, she hid her talents in the service of modesty and humility.
One can well imagine from these brief glimpses into her life, as to the direction it would take. She was no longer interested in Kirkland Lake because it lacked music and it lacked life. Music was one thing that stirred her little world, and each time she had enough left over from all her benevolent activities, she would run over to a local store and buy a new LP.
Once while running to the store for a LP, she met a young woman in distress, and from then onward, she made sure that her own pockets were full so as to be of help to her and all others living through some sad misadventure. She ensured that her personal pocket funds were enough for five or six different families. Now you can well imagine her collection of people and places that needed her attention in Kirkland Lake. With such a kind heart and gentle ways, she also attracted many suitors.
Among her suitors, there was one handsome lad named “B….”, and he couldn’t help admiring her, couldn’t help loving her, he couldn’t help gifting her with flowers when she was far away. Even though she made it clear, that she was far too independent to be just ‘someone’s wife’, he harbored the deepest sentiments for her. When she left Kirkland Lake to live in London, England, he was broken-hearted, but he comforted himself by sending her a dozen red roses a week.
Fast forward into 2020: Now in her senior years, she found herself quite burned and scorched through years of sacrifice she realized she could not deliver that ‘unconditional love’, without injuring herself. Yet she hung onto her “Holy Grail”. Then one day, (2021) while surfing the net, she came across Joe’s words,
“ I personally don’t even think that unconditional love is an ideal. I think you’ve got to have a discriminating faculty and let bastards be bastards and let those that ought to be hit in the jaw get it. In fact, I have a list. If anybody has a working guillotine, I’d be glad to give them my list.”
A Joseph Campbell CompanionThat was the end of her old myth, and beginning of a new one. The discriminating faculty is working towards a new adventure. Here again, I am reminded of what Dennis said in his presentation, “you know that the old myth is dying when you can’t do much anymore..”
Shaahayda (with gratitude to all who participate here)
[i] https://www.leftcom.org/en/articles/2002-11-01/book-review-lamps-forever-lit
So many thanks for your kind and appreciative words for this suggestion, Dennis. “Sandy and I were both so affected by this primal plot of identity, cultural taboos, prejudices, hurts, absence of courage, as when no one comes to his defense over his using the word “spook” to mean invisibles in class and who lament, as the one black professor did at Coleman’s funeral. And is this where we are today with the fictions perpetrated in our country and will years from now people step forward and say they should have spoken up?”
What a thought provoking question, “will people step forward and say they should have spoken up? ” Difficult to say, because both on the societal level and the personal level, our views are shaped by a multitude of factors. It’s more and more about how to be in fields where much is earned rather than in fields that let us explore cultural and societal issues, and that let us focus on our need to work in the formation of a better gentler society.
On a more important note: I loved your conference-interactive-presentation on “The Mythology of Belief”. So much to say on the topic but in the interest of brevity, I’ll ask just two, later.
Shaheda (very grateful for today’s presentation)
Thank you very much Dennis. I signed up for the “Mythology of Belief” class which is offered on July 16, 2021. I looked at your July 17th schedule while surfing the Jung Center’s website, and the website shows the identical course for Saturday July 17, that is the “Mythology of Belief. ” Just wanted to check with you whether your writing workshop has been moved to another date. Looking forward to the Friday offering. I’ll write to mcraig@junghouston.org as well.
Thank you
Shaheda
Dennis,
So many thanks to you for your generous response as you prepare for your talks on “Myth and Healing”, and on “Mythology of Belief”.
You wrote, “Belief as myth; belief as ordering principle. This is my area of exploration these past months: “The Mythology of Belief” and I will be offering some retreats on it.” Dennis, I love the topic, and one day, I hope to attend your retreats. Where is this one being held? I searched your website for recent events and found “Myth and Healing” (keynote speaker) July 30-August 1, 2021. Is this an online event? I could not locate “Mythology of Belief”.
“We are in a terrain today where fundamental local and national mythologies are breaking down; what rushes to fill that void is fantasies, alternative facts and fictions to bolster ideologies”
In a nation with such a diverse population, people from all over the world, with their own beliefs, rituals and rites, and then there are so many economic classes, the working class, the middle and the upper and then the billionaire class – a unifying myth seems many mythic years away, and as you so well expressed, “So, a unifying myth may not be possible until a further collapse of the condo of our national identity becomes more acute…….. We are in the in-between state right now, as Ishmael says of Queequeg; he is neither caterpillar nor butterfly; he is in between, as we are now.”
Joe said, “And when you think of this! The number of men who are in fact responsible for the condition of the world right now could all be contained in this room, and they are acting as though there were no way of common understanding. The world is in chaos simply as a function of their inability to assume the middle position in a conversation.” We could begin a dialogue of a unifying myth.
“Becoming transparent to transcendence–JC’s language– is one way towards that end, fortified as it must be, with compassion as the new cement to hold it in place against hurricanes, seas and other challenges to its skyward push.” And the transcendence may shine through all of us too, through the spiritual things we talk about.
I am so happy to hear that you and Sandy plan on watching the “Human Stain”. Please if you have time, let me know what you and Sandy thought and your analysis of Coleman’s personal myth, the conflict and the chaos vis a vis the inner laws of the myth.
Shaheda (in gratitude)
“ Each person’s life has it’s own context and mine certainly is no different; but for me the catalyst and guiding force was the individual personal myth; and up to that point my life was so very chaotic. So this idea of personal myth is a big deal to me because I have lived with it and understand what significance it can make within one’s life context. I’ve thought about this topic a lot ever since I saw it on Dennis’s blog; .”
James, what a prolific, powerful and thought evoking piece. Many lines cause me to pause, and evaluate the many stages in my own life where I felt ‘lost’. One’s personal myth is as you say, ‘a big deal’. As Joe says, “If you live with the myths in your mind, you will find yourself always in mythological situations. They cover everything that can happen to you. And that enables you to interpret the myth in relation to life, as well as life in relation to myth”
I realized I was lost only when I took time to reflect, but then the feeling of being lost was fleeting, because I was sailing on a boat without a rudder and I remained lost off and on until I began ‘following my bliss’…
Of course following one’s bliss also implies, “As you proceed through life, following your own path, birds will shit on you. Don’t bother to brush it off.” Well, there are still huge blisters from following my bliss, but I have learned when to stand up and when to sit down.
Regarding the film Human Stain that I mentioned in my response to Dennis. It confirmed the notion that a personal myth is a ‘big deal’. “Not having the courage to change the narrative” is what the film “Human Stain” is about (IMO)
In this film, Prof. Coleman (Anthony Hopkins) is living a dream life as a Prof. of Classics, but is also living a lie, by passing as a Jewish immigrant, instead of a light skinned handsome young man born to African-American parents. In search of a job, he entered ‘white’ as his race, thinking that he would easily get the spot in the Navy, which he did. Later in life, he is a Professor of Classics, (played by Anthony Hopkins) married successful and blissful by many measures.
As the story climaxes, he is accused of ‘racism’ by the University Board ———-He is quoted as having said, “Does anyone know these people? Do they exist or are they spooks?” – – (he has never seen these students, and has no idea they are African-American). In anger he resigns, his wife dies and one day he falls in love with a young woman Faunia (played by beautiful Nicole Kidman). After his wife’s death, he begins to live a life he never planned, but to which he is attracted as a moth loves the flame. The end leaves one wondering. Was he killed by Lester (Faunia’s jealous husband) or by Lester who could have discovered Coleman’s heritage and thus led Coleman to end it all himself? A lie about his race got him the job, and accused of racism is how he loses the job.
I wish you could find time to watch this James. In the film, Prof. Coleman hires a investigative journalist to write about his life and to cover the wrong done to him by the University Board. There too, he lacked courage to disclose his ethnicity. I am reminded of Joe’s words, “why write a limerick when you can write a sonnet.” I am so moved by the words of N. J. Girardot, “The logic of myth claims that there is always no matter how it’s disguised, qualified and suppressed a hidden connection or inner law linking chaos and cosmos and nature and culture’.
James what you wrote (see below)fits Prof. Coleman’s personal myth to a “T”,
“There is a terrific version of the Hero/Call/Quest motif he gives in one of his lectures where he talks about the “formula of quest”. He says it starts when life dries up and something is missing so the hero goes in quest to find out what it is and make it his own. It is a solitary call by nature and you must become a detective, a hunter following a path into your own dark forest where you don’t know where you are going or what it is you are looking for but you are following this razor’s edge of your night-sea journey to find your grail castle where the answers or illuminations reside. (And the important thing here he stresses is that “there are no set rules” for how this motif unfolds.) It is unique to you alone.”
Shaheda
Dear Dennis,
Thank you so much for another thought provoking topic and your rich essay and thank you Stephen, James and everyone else who has participated in this thread. I have had an enormously wonderful time reading all the responses and assimilating them.
“…………. Incarceration is physical, while imprisonment is psychological and mythic.”
Dennis your words spoke to me as I watched the film “Human Stain”. Imprisonment in life for Prof. Coleman Silk, was a lie on his job application. Born to African-American parents, he is light-skinned who passes for a Jew and even marries a Jewish woman. In search of a job, he entered ‘white’ as his race, thinking that he would easily get the spot in the Navy, which he did. Later in life, he is a Professor of Classics, (played by Anthony Hopkins) and has lived his life by breaking away from his family of birth as well.
As the story climaxes, he is accused of ‘racism’ by the University Board ———-using the word “spook”— “Does anyone know these people? Do they exist or are they spooks?” – – he has never seen these students, and has no idea they are African-American). In anger he resigns, his wife dies and one day he falls in love with a young woman Faunia (played by beautiful Nicole Kidman). After that he is living a life he never planned on living but to which he is attracted as a moth loves the flame. The end leaves one wondering. Was he killed by Lester (Faunia’s jealous husband) or by Lester who could have discovered Coleman’s heritage and thus led Coleman to end it all himself? A lie about his race got him the job, and accused of racism is how he loses the job. Lacking self-affirmation, one’s end is obscure, and the courage to affirm would have written a totally different ending, a different myth?
Thank you Dennis for the awesome citation —-The Masks of God, Vol. 3: Occidental Mythology: “The virtue of heroism must lie, therefore… not in the will to reform, but in the courage to affirm, the nature of the universe.”
I am reminded of N. J. Girardot on the logic of myth: “The logic of myth claims that there is always no matter how it’s disguised, qualified and suppressed a hidden connection or inner law linking chaos and cosmos and nature and culture’.
Shaheda (thanking all who are here)
Stephen, so glad to hear that you and Des are enjoying your time together visiting siblings and having a joyous time. Thank you so much for your reference to Joe’s description of A-U-M as the kind of silence that contains ALL — “this Silence contains All, is the source of All, and is that to which All will eventually dissolve and return” is a powerful reminder to Krishnamurti’s talk on silence.
In his talk on Silence, Krishnamurti describes two silences: 1) Cessation of Noise and end of tension 2) Real Silence is entirely different, and not the outcome of tension. This kind of silence is like going through a small hole to an enormously wide expansive ocean. This silence one cannot understand verbally, unless, one has understood the structure and meaning of consciousness –at this point the brain cells have ceased, and come upon that mystery which no one can describe. As you quoted Joe Campbell from ‘ The Flight of the Wild Gander’, ” The soul is to be propelled both by and from this syllable AUM into the silence beyond and all around it: the silence out of which it rises and back into which it goes when pronounced—slowly and rhythmically …as AUM—AUM—AUM.” (from The Flight of the Wild Gander)
Another kind of silence Krishnamurti dwells upon is a silence that is a result of OBSERVATION –observing something without reaction, without judgement. When there is a reaction to that which is said, then that is not silence. In his talk on ‘Total silence mind comes upon the eternal’, Krishnamurti says, “So we are talking of a stillness which is not dependent on anything. And it is only that quality of stillness, that absolute silence of the mind that can see that which is eternal, timeless, nameless. This is meditation. ..”
https://jkrishnamurti.org/content/total-silence-mind-comes-upon-eternal
Dr. Bucher, you wrote, ” I find my comfort level with silence increases with age. As I go into the weekend, I am searching for the moments I will have that I can “fill” with silence. ” I find that my comfort level with silence has increased modestly with age but not really there. Did you achieve this stage by self-control, exercising discipline, going on forest walks, or was it something that just happened over time? Would love to hear your response.
Shaahayda
Dr. Slattery, so much gratitude to you for planting the seeds of the power of the personal. And thank you James and all others who are moving this thread, and branching into different areas of the personal and the power that lies therein.
James, you branched into an immensely important topic of “aging”. You wrote,
” For most of human history the elder adults lived and died within the family unit; and grandparents were an essential part of the family structure because the interplay between: young, middle, and elder individuals not only gave life meaning and purpose; it provided the necessary tools to navigate the life process; but there have been some huge alterations within modern society that reflect so much of it’s present dysfunction.”
Yes indeed there have been massive alterations in our societal makeup which is to blame for our many unforeseen dysfunctionalities. Massive alterations can also be viewed as progress in science and technology. Take for example the field of medicine. “For most of human history, medicine could do little to prevent or cure illness or extend life, and living to an old age required considerable good fortune. But now medicine has not only cured illness but extended life thus changing our perception of aging and death.”(Field MJ, 1997)
Over half a century ago, Alan Watts wrote, “…problem is that people live far longer because of medicine, and the aging population is accustomed to thinking that death can be indefinitely postponed.” (Watts, 1978). Hence, aging and eventually death in our global culture is an act of resistance. How to avoid it, how not to talk about it, how to think of things other than our mortality. And we continue to avoid this important conversation with ourselves and with others.
In his book, “The Second Wind”, Dr. Bill Thomas navigates us to a path of facing our eventual mortality, and reflecting upon it. He suggests that life can be reimagined. It’s a time of reflection, of new understanding, of illumination. New ways of living and working are waiting to be explored as we age. He guides us into ways of recognizing our most challenging yet most fulfilling stage in life which he refers to as “Elderhood”.
Elderhood, he writes, “offers a depth that far exceeds either the untested innocence of childhood or the frenzied activities of adulthood. Age requires new and unfamiliar and unpleasant sacrifices from us. For Americans and especially for members of the postwar generation, elderhood remains an undiscovered territory. We can explore it if we have the courage to go deep inside ourselves. Its with losing the fear of death that we will be rewarded with a feeling of accomplishment.”
A large body of research points to cultural and historical influences that shape our attitudes towards death and some recent research also affirms that death is an individual journey, shaped by our personal biographies. In most cultures, younger relatives often have a difficult understanding the stories elders tell and retell, writes Dr. Thomas. “…. if it’s not dementia, then I suggest that they understand that repetition is sort of a sophisticated effort to address unresolved conflict, long suppressed anger and disappointments. ”
For Americans and especially for members of the postwar generation, elderhood remains an undiscovered territory. We can explore it if we have the courage to go deep inside ourselves. It’s with losing the fear of death that we will be rewarded with a feeling of accomplishment…..Elderhood is deep. (The Second Wind –pg. 217)
James, I wish to acknowledge you for having led me to this important book. A few years ago, I too did a study on how to reduce fear of death, and whether reflection on this important subject could ease anxiety and depression among the elderly, who are now confined to nursing homes, assisted living facilities and long term care centers.
“The conquest of the fear of death is the recovery of life’s joy. One can experience an unconditional affirmation of life only when one has accepted death, not as contrary to life, but as an aspect of life. Life in its becoming is always shedding death, and on the point of death. The conquest of fear yields the courage of life.”
— Joseph Campbell
Joseph Campbell and the Power of Myth with Bill Moyers (book) (p. 125) (jcf.org)Shaheda
Hello Dr. Bucher,
I very much enjoyed reading your Mythblast article, and contemplated a good deal on times that I remained silent when I ought to have spoken. Actually, I regret that I did not speak up — I question myself as to why I sat shocked and distressed in school, and later on in my life too. That’s just me. But then there are many forms of silences. There’s silence when we meditate (here we try and silence the mind). The kind of silence that I regret upon is perhaps called a ‘baffled silence of confusion’. There is a silence when we experience a peaceful accord with the environment, with the sunrise and the sunset. Listening to music and songs requires deep silence from my part for I find I can’t listen to my songs when those who don’t appreciate my kind of music are around. I want to be alone and silent.
You asked, “I’ve sometimes wondered how a young Joseph Campbell might have maneuvered in our modern world of social media. Ours is an age where silence has become a rare commodity. We are constantly spoken to (and many times shouted at), both with visuals and audio, through televisions, phones, computers, and any number of communication and entertainment devices. In a world where individuals are more often treated as consumers than humans, multi-billion-dollar industries work around the clock to assure we are never afforded a moment of silence.”
Dr. Bucher, I thought a good deal on the subject, and my answer is this: Joseph Campbell would have accepted it and found ways to maneuver in this high tech, supersonic, space age, cyberspace world. Reason is that according to Joe, the main function of a myth was to support and validate a given moral order of the society in which the individual is to live.
Additionally, Joe and Jean were good friends with John Cage, who experimented with Silence and wrote a good deal on the subject. “There is no such thing as an empty space or an empty time. There is always something to see, something to hear. In fact, try as we may to make a silence, we cannot.” (Silence: Lectures and Writings – John Cage)
I love what Aldous Huxley said, “After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is music.” That’s baffled silence to me. Another kind of silence I have personally experienced is a silence that comes with falling in love. I felt tongue tied, not being able to say what needed to be said…there were more than one hundred emotions that confused my speaking mind. Another kind of silence and not speaking up is the time that I didn’t reach out and apologize to a very dear Uncle before he passed away — staying silent then would not have been the right thing for me. The dying too want to reach out and speak to their loved ones before taking their last breath.
On the other hand, Carl Jung said, “Talking is often a torment to me and I need several days of silence to recover the futility of words”. But I do think that Joe would have accepted the new world with an unmatched poetic sense and integrated well with his new world.
The material of music is sound and silence. Integrating these is composing. – (John Cage)
Again, thank you for a thought provoking piece, Dr. Bucher. I’ll link this to a story I have in mind.
Shaheda
Thank you again for this powerful post James, which covers many issues –COVID and isolation, role of social media in our lives, mental health, teen isolation and more. The issue that led me to recall this particular story that I am going to tell, is on teaching kids to write about themselves.
The story is about Alanis Obomsawin, CC GOQ (born August 31, 1932) who is an American Canadian Abenaki filmmaker, singer, artist and activist mostly known for her documentary films. Born in New Hampshire, United States and raised primarily in Quebec, Canada, she has written and directed many National Film Board of Canada documentaries on First Nations issues.
She began her career as a professional singer and storyteller before joining the National Film Board (NFB) in 1967. Her award-winning films address the struggles of Indigenous peoples in Canada from their perspective, giving prominence to voices that have long been ignored or dismissed. The basic purpose of her films is to give a voice to her people and to have their existence recognized — to speak of their values, their beliefs, their songs, and that it’s alright to be a native person in North America.
It was my good fortune to meet Alanis in person, and to hear her sing songs, and tell stories of her people. Her own story from her life in a school in Trois-Rivière touched me to the bones. The emotions in her voice as she narrated her short story resonate in my being to this day.
Her parents left New Hampshire and moved to Trois-Rivières, in Quebec, Canada. Her mother’s cousin, initiated her into the history of the Abenaki Nation and taught her many songs and legends. But in Trois-Rivière, she was cut off from her tradition, she spoke little French and not a word of English, but she held tightly to the songs and stories taught by her aunt on the reserve.
James, you wrote, “One of our chief moderators; Michael Lambert; over the years has brought up the importance of teaching kids to: “write about themselves”; to explore their inner feelings and to connect these insights to their developing understanding of what archetypes and mythic themes are and to be able to see these things in everyday life and how this relates to them. But what one of the most illuminating questions he would often have to address from them is: “I just don’t know how to write about myself”.
Yes indeed, “I just didn’t know how to express myself until ” was Alanis’ story. It so happened that the girls at the Trois-Rivières school had made a practice to circle around Alanis during their lunch break and beat her up. This happened every single day for a year or more, perhaps more. Alanis was embarrassed, ashamed, as if she had done something wrong. She spoke not a word, to anyone at school. The year she turned 12, was also the year that her father died, and she had to be in school the day after his death. Lunch break arrived, the girls came around to form a circle and begin their beating. This time, Alanis was not the old Alanis, she got up and beat each and every single one of them. They never ever came for her. The beating stopped. Alanis had changed and so did the girls. She did not say, “it’s always been this way” she fought back, and “participated in it and freed herself from an operatic nightmare”. She refused to be locked in the cage of her never ending pain. That day, I learned a lot from Alanis.
More about Alanis’ films and other works can be found here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alanis_Obomsawin
Shaheda
Hello Dr. Slattery and James,
I apologize for taking your time on the same thread again, but thought I’d add another line or two on the topic of shame/crucifixion.
Revisiting your previous answer, where you said, “What your shaming/crucifixion makes me remember is C.G. Jung’s observation that no process of individuation can begin without an initial crucifixion. That condition can arrive in the form of an illness, a loss, a breakup of an intimate relationship and of course so many more.”
You wrote that the ” individuation process is complex”. How complex is also impossible to determine until one is in the middle of very rough and choppy seas. Those seeking resurrection need only heed Odysseus. Like him one must remain tied to the mast of the ship, struggling to resist the Sirens’ song, ears plugged with beeswax.
You wrote, “Your equating it with a crucifixion is not off the mark, for becoming conscious of shame’s presence can lead to action, often in the form of a change in attitude towards oneself and others…” This resonates with me and I am reminded of one of Joe’s quotes:
“If you want the whole thing, the gods will give it to you. But you must be ready for it.”
— Joseph CampbellAnd if by “the whole thing”, Joe’s reference is to “resurrection”, then the one seeking it should be prepared for shame/crucifixion. Andre Gide said it well, “You cannot discover new oceans unless you have the courage to lose sight of the shore.”
I want to link this to our current affairs: A tragic and macabre part of Canada’s hidden history made headlines during the first week in June after ground-penetrating radar located the remains of 215 First Nations children in a mass unmarked grave on the grounds of the former Kamloops Indian Residential School (KIRS). The discovery of Indigenous children found in KIRS shook Canada to its core. Calls for a public apology from the federal government, compensation, release of records, and the same from the Catholic Church came pouring in. But the leaders of many tribes in British Columbia, in my view, are ready for their resurrection. Why one might ask?
Reason: they are not seeking compensation, they are not seeking back door legal settlements. They want to tell their story, they want to be ‘heard’. As simple as that. Take for example, Eddy Charlie of of another Residential School, who says that the pain has stayed with him throughout his life. He turned to alcohol as a way of coping, which led to anger and damaged relationships —
“Stop asking how you can help — and listen, says B.C. residential school survivor. Eddy Charlie, a survivor of the Kuper Island Residential School, doesn’t want people to ask how they can help. Instead, he would like them to just listen to the stories of survivors like himself.”
“Charlie said survivors often carry so much shame and anger that it makes it impossible to talk about their experiences. And if they do talk about it, they’re worried how others will react. “
It’s when they seek neither compensation, nor awards and memorials but just want to be ‘heard’, with ears plugged with bees wax, that’s when they are ready. As Joe said, “If you want the whole thing, the gods will give it to you. But you must be ready for it.”
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/eddy-charlie-residential-school-survivor-1.6049423
“Yet, soul often awakens in the darkest hours as something deeper and wiser stirs within us. “
Shaheda
