[jamesn.]

Wow; what a wonderful additional followup Stephen; and adds so much rich material to contemplate moving deeper into this discussion of endless fascination concerning our Shadow life. I always learn so much from these insights you bring; especially concerning your understanding of dreams and how they can inform us about who we are and what’s going on inside. I still keep pen and paper beside my bed where I can jot stuff down upon waking from a dream I think is trying to tell me something and can later reflect on it to see if I can figure out it’s reference.

Drewie; if you have not seen it Stephen also has put together a tremendous thread of dream related reference material in the 1,000 Faces category of these forums.

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(Also) it’s worth mentioning in case you didn’t know concerning something “I forgot to do”; which is to hit the (reply) button in the box of the specific entry you are replying to “before” entering any text. (You will notice my earlier reply located below this one is now out of sync with the ordered sequence of entries because I forgot to do this.) This feature is located in the top right corner of each post and is a special feature Stephen has added which “indents” that reply allowing a person to respond to a specific entry without it becoming lost in a conversation with multiple participants. Click on this “reply button” (first) before entering your text in the entry you are addressing in the top right corner of the post. If you click on that “before” you enter any text your reply will be entered as a response to “that” particular person’s entry which helps to keep order within a multiple person topic. Also in the top right corner is an entry (number) which will help you to locate that post should you forget where it is. This is a very handy feature to help everyone keep track of who said what and when they said it in a multiple page topic instead of just scrolling through endless posts until you locate what you are trying to address. (It’s a relatively new feature that’s been added recently to the forum discussions and should become invaluable as these conversations progress on into the future.)

[jamesn.]

Hey Drewie; so good to see you here on the new version of CoaHO. I’m sorry I’m so late in getting to this and I think the point you raise is a very valid one concerning the influence our dark side brings out in us; much of which I think has to do with the part emotion plays in firing up our shadow aspect because as you so insightfully bring up “that” is the role it plays in stimulating all those things about ourselves we don’t want to admit. It’s our blind side; it’s compulsive; (meaning we are not going to get rid of it); but as Joseph points out it also has rich potential aspects of ourselves that have never been recognized therefore it can also be a mystery dimension of transformation; such as love thy neighbor as thy self because he “is” yourself; we just can’t see it necessarily because it’s stirring up all this deep buried material that has never been given a voice. However I absolutely do not think this means this dark aspect should not be misunderstood as to it’s destructive potential either. I was reading on pages 48-49; in Calvin Hall and Vernon J. Nordby’s: “Primer of Jungian Psychology”; that Jung considered the shadow the most powerful of all the archetypes and says this is why:

“The Shadow contains more of the basic animal nature than any other archetype does. Because of it’s extremely deep roots in evolutionary history, it is probably the most powerful and the most dangerous of all the archetypes. It is the source of all that is best and worst in man, especially in his relations with others of the same sex.

In order for a person to become an integral member of the community, it is necessary to tame his animal spirits contained in the shadow. This taming is accomplished by suppressing manifestations of the shadow and by developing a strong persona which counteracts the power of the shadow. The person who suppresses the animal side of his nature may become civilized, but he does so at the expense of decreasing the motive power for spontaneity, creativity, strong emotions, and deep insights. He cuts himself off from the wisdom that may be more profound than any learning or culture can provide. A shadowless life tends to become shallow and spiritless.”

The text develops this understanding further by adding other dimensions of the interplay between various components of the psyche and goes on to explain several examples of the psyche’s relationship to the shadow and summarizes these relationships at the end by saying on page 51:

“In summary, then, it may be said of the shadow archetype that it gives to man’s personality a full bodied, three-dimensional quality. These instincts are responsible for man’s vitality, creativity, vivacity, and vigor. Rejection of the shadow flattens the personality.”
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Indeed in much of Joseph’s insights is the understanding that the shadow is our dark side of our light side; or those things we don’t want to like about ourselves that are “stimulated” by something we see or experience in others that; as you so insightfully point out; in many ways reside within ourselves; but don’t realize are there. And as you also bring up take considerable effort to bring to realization. “But” Joseph also points out that the shadow contains deep and powerful dimensions and values also that if understood can be harnessed.

In one of my most favorite lectures of his when talking about “integration” of this shadow side as a part of the individuation process he suggests; ” you don’t have to let this thing take over your psyche; “take the guy you want to murder and beat him at golf”. This shadow reaction that comes up is often brought on by enantiodromia where there is a swing from one side of the psychic energy system to the other because of a blockage; usually by some conflict that is being worked out within the unconscious; so a symbol or reference of some kind is often conjured up by the “transcendent function” that allows the libido to break through this blockage so the psychic energy can return to it’s natural flowing state once this blockage or obstruction has been removed and the conflict which caused this blockage; (often by the “shadow”); is resolved; and a new form of transformation of consciousness has been brought about thereby resulting in a new way of seeing or understanding of that which was a barrier before.

I won’t continue on further except to say these are my interpretations of the Jungian shadow and how I have come to understand Joseph’s explanations of this interplay within the psyche; and certainly others may disagree. (That’s why we’re here discussing these things right?) Again it’s so good to see you here diving into these discussions just like the old days. Welcome back my friend.

One more thing I will add before I close. (In Diane Osbon’s: “Reflections on the Art of Living – A Joseph Campbell Companion”); on page 155-158; there is a great example of this symbol making process where she quotes Joseph’s use of the double triangles in the “Star of David”; and shows how a symbol like this can be used to resolve an internal conflict.) Also there are a number of points of reference contained within Darryl Sharps: “Jungian Lexicon” which you may already have access to; but just in case you don’t it is posted above and I will also leave the link to it here.

[jamesn.]

Also; I will add one more short clip with Joseph describing the individual’s unique quest to find their own personal myth through “the left hand path.” (It should also be understood that the artist falls into this category as well.)

 

[jamesn.]

Craig; thank you for refining this last part for indeed in each of our journeys it is the: “riding of the leopard without being torn to pieces”; on which our trajectory puts us that makes this: “at least I tried damn it” so critically important. This thing Joseph Campbell called: “One’s Bliss”; that push out of our own existence that Joseph informs us takes us out on the razor’s edge path into the dark unknown forest by ourselves where we have no idea of where we are going except we know we have to go. That dark night of the soul’s journey filled with self-doubt and constant struggle which contains moments of deep despair and yet in the distance there is a “numinous” glow; that “Telesphorus Lantern” that leads us on telling our heart and soul this where I have to go because this is who and what I am. The answers I am seeking are there because the experiences I am having tell me so in a language that only I can understand.

Thank you for this incredibly illuminating set of posts that have been so exhilarating to partake with you. (I have left a private message in the top left side panel of this forum where you click on the bottom right corner to open which I hope is self-explanatory on how much I have enjoyed it.)

I will leave a separate link here that may better explain my thoughts on why I think these things we’ve been talking about are so extremely important in today’s Covid moment in time.

[jamesn.]

Marianne; (as I was attempting to post a reply I noticed after I posted it several other entries had already been given; so with that in mind I don’t think there is any variation of relevance so I’ll leave what I originally posted just the way it was).  I came across something else of Joseph’s on page 123; from Diane Osbon’s: “Reflections on the Art of Living – A Joseph Campbell Companion”; that was very insightful concerning how to read this language of dreams we are trying to decipher.
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” The secret of dreams is that subject and object are the same. The object is self-luminous, fluent in form, multivalent in it’s meanings. It’s your dream, the manifestation of your will, and yet you are surprised by it. This is the relationship of ego-consciousness to the unconscious. Ego-consciousness has to learn about the unconscious, and dreams are the vocabulary of the unconscious speaking to the conscious mind. Yet, in dreams and visions, subject and object are the same.”

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Not to over simplify what Joseph is describing concerning how the language dreams speaks to us; but since so much of it is rendered through symbolic imagery we have to have some kind of starting place from which to access what they are communicating. Because dreams are so personal and that there is so many more elements to this internal landscape I think this might be a good place to consider as we go further into how the psyche and it’s different components interplay as we enter this separate world of which we know very little. (Then there is the matter of age and the way symbols change their meaning over time concerning the way they are interpreted by the dreamer.)

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In “Pathways to Bliss” on page 80; Joseph says this:

“Jung says life is like the day of a solar journey. The first part of it is up; moving from birth to the society. And the second part of it is down, moving from participation in the world and the society to death. And whereas the threat of the first half of life was life, the threat of the second half is death., and all the symbols are changing meaning.

Through the remaining part of life, Jung says, the great problem is integrating the inferior with the superior functions. That’s the great task of your later years.”

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As far as going further into the width, breadth, and depth of this subject volumes have been written; but concerning this little portion I have taken from these two texts my main purpose was to share a couple of insights of Joseph’s I thought might be of interest for I am certainly no Jungian Analyst. I did however want to leave a short clip of Joseph’s here. This was part of a lecture – (Volume 6; II.6.I Modern Myths of Quest); available for purchase from the JC Foundation Audio Lecture downloads section; that Joseph was delivering concerning enantiodromia and the individuation process; and his point about the voice of: “Too Late” definitely makes itself known in dreams in later life.

[jamesn.]

Craig; Wow; just Wow! Thank you so much for your thoughtful and deeply considered response. You’ve given me a great deal to reflect on with these posts; and I will look forward to hearing the rest when you can come back. I hope all goes well for you until then; and again; thank you so very much for taking the time to share such kind encouraging insights.  Namaste

[jamesn.]

Craig; I wish I could find the words to describe how much I was moved by your thoughtful and penetrating insights in this reply. I just want to read them over and over again and let them sink in and savior them. Your sensitive and intuitive understanding; much less your articulation just speaks volumes to what I was attempting to describe. In dark times such as these with Covid and misinformation everywhere once in a while a light shines in the dark; and like Jung’s Telesphorus points the way. You may have seen this but if not I hope it compliments what you so beautifully rendered.  (Yes; perhaps I’m plagiarizing a bit here; but I’m also stealing from the best and trying to make it my own.) Seriously; such a wonderful reply and so deeply appreciated. Thank you.

[jamesn.]

A warm greeting Craig; so glad to be enjoying this wonderful conversation you’ve been having and I would like to add my enthusiastic emphasis on the word: “numinous”; since it bridges the gap between both the religious and more importantly the spiritual dimension of the great mystery that often gets confused that Joseph so articulately separates when discussing terms like: transcendent and experience in reference to meaning. Zimmer’s distinctions; which were brought up earlier; capture this understanding in a way westerners often encounter difficulty with because in western theology and religion there is no context for them to relate to as in Joseph’s description of the “symbol without meaning” or (isness); if you prefer. And to a Judeo/Christian or Muslim often the idea of “you” being the God who defines that experience in terms of: “the ground of one’s own being”; symbolizes blasphemy or heresy as opposed to oneness or as Joseph again might describe as: “the light inside the bulb” that returns to it’s source in terms of a larger universe in which it is enclosed. These concepts are totally alien just as the Buddha’s symbol of a single flower being held up as the wordless sermon delivered as this metaphor.

I want to add one other idea that Joseph emphasized that often gets lost when referring back to him in particular that has to do with his connection to Jungian ideas which I will quote that I used in a separate conversation I had about this misconception of him being a Jungian and will place below:

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Joseph’s conversations with Michael Toms in: “An Open Life” brought up an interesting thing that always grabs my attention in a powerful way when I think about the relationship between Jung’s ideas and how people mistake Joseph for a Jungian which he defiantly refuses. I thought you might have some thoughts about this since you are so familiar with his work and it deals specifically with how one should approach their own myth they are constructing.
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On page 123 the conversation states:

Toms:
“Jungian psychology seems to be more open than other more traditional forms of interpretation.”

Joseph:
“You know for some people, “Jungian” is a nasty word, and it has been flung at me by certain reviewers as though to say, “Don’t bother with Joe Campbell; he’s a Jungian. ” I’m not a Jungian! As far as interpreting myths, Jung gives me the best clues I’ve got. But I’m much more interested in diffusion and relationships historically than Jung was, so that the Jungians view me as a kind of questionable person. I don’t use those formula words very often in my interpretation of myths, but Jung gives me the background from which to let the myth talk to me.

If I do have a guru of that sort, it would be Zimmer—the one who really gave me the courage to interpret myths out of what I knew of their common symbols. There is always a risk there, but it’s the risk of your own adventure instead of just gluing yourself to what someone else has found.”
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I think this is a huge statement because to me he is saying: (You) are the God that is creating your own life; and you are the one deciding what your myth is to be not someone else. This is the left hand path Joseph talks about that informs the modern hero archetype the individual must listen to in traversing out of and beyond their ropes in order to find and know who and what they are to become. They are not only flying blind making their path up as they go; but they are not obeying any kind of set rulebook on how this is done.
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And I will also like to add a short clip of Joseph describing this distinction in another more succinct way that may better illustrate my point about the individual interpretation of their own experience here.

I hope you’ll forgive my rather clumsy descriptions on this topic for I am certainly no authority on this subject; and again; so glad to have you here among us on these forums and look forward to hearing more on this wonderful discussion!

[jamesn.]

Also I want to add an addendum clip to the above of Joseph’s to further describe this overriding arc-of-life schedule the psyche is constantly checking in the way it sees itself in relation to where it wants to go here.

[jamesn.]

Dennis; thank you for your most thoughtful and kind reply regarding dreams and journaling. Listening to our inner voices that speak to us in a language that is sometimes difficult to read; (and); as you so insightfully suggest; are presenting us with this inner dialogue of the “Marga Path” that Joseph talks about to show us clues on what our changing life needs are revealing. This “animal path back to it’s den” represents this longing of the human heart to return; (like the great animal migrations); to it’s home where it instinctively knows it should be. And these dreams as you suggest are pointing the way.

In the movie: “Dances with Wolves” one of the central voices of the story is the: (Journal as narrator); which the main character uses to record, assimilate, and understand his adventure as he experiences his transcendent transformation from Union Army Lt. John Dunbar into the Lakota Sioux Warrior: “Dances with Wolves”. As both a personal document and record of his transformation in the climax of the film the Journal is captured but retrieved and returned; which therefore could be understood as symbolizing the completion of this new rebirth cycle of individuation towards wholeness as seen throughout nature and also within our own final destination toward our journey’s end. The snake sheds it’s skin; as does the moon cycles to completion; these symbols are everywhere showing us we are but a strand of nature’s web throughout our journey; and the psyche reflects this inner metamorphosis from childhood to death. Are we the light or the bulb that carries it? Yet here we are as modern individuals disconnected from our own source; confused and seeking to reunite with our own inner being that seeks to know itself as if for the first time.

The backstory behind this film is almost as interesting as the story itself because the artist/writer had to undergo the same hero/quest to bring it to fruition with all kinds of hurdles to endure. As a metaphor this refers back to the relationship of a native people to their environment and their responses to life demands and the disappearance of their way of life by modern civilization; and also points to mankind’s disconnection and the loss of his relationship to his “inner world” that must be reconciled toward wholeness; (i,e. Marga or Bastion’s elementary idea as opposed to Desi which is the local or provential – the right and left hand paths that Joseph talks about).

What I am referring to is your descriptions of the inner processes we all must assimilate as we both attempt to read our outer and inner landscapes to navigate where we are trying go; and what our inner world is asking of us to get there. There are all kinds of outer displays we have to interpret along the way; some are “trickster” situations; some are random occurrences we collide with; some might be seen or understood as fate; but many are also determined by our inner longings and fears guarded over by our inner Dragons we must deal with and the many “Thou Shalt” scales that their skin contains; each one referring to something we must overcome as Joseph discusses with Bill Moyers in: “The Power of Myth”.

Although I’m sure you are more than familiar with this aspect of Jungian psychology for those who are not I’m adding a short clip of Joseph’s description of the Shadow system which would be helpful to understand in Dream Journaling since this shadow dimension of the personal unconscious is important in what is happening in your inner world and therefore reflected in your dreams as well as your waking life and is asking to be recognized; especially in dreams such as nightmares as well as possibly others with strong emotions.

I hope you’ll forgive my rather clumsy attempts at description as in some of the other forum threads we are discussing topics concerning dreams and emotions and various other aspects we all must learn how to utilize in understanding this inner narrative of our lives and what it’s trying to tell us.  Again; your voice is so deeply appreciated in sharing your many years of experience helping to provide tools on how we can do this. A very warm Namaste to you as always.

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My apologies to any who have already seen this post earlier for I have re-edited it and added an extra short clip of Joseph’s below to help explain the relationships to the above which is included in it’s very brief description.

[jamesn.]

Thank you Stephen for setting this up as a separate topic; and actually on thinking about this further could actual contain 2 different ways of approaching it: the way we look at our dreams; and also how we think about emotion itself.

One of the things I keep coming back to is Joseph’s description of the (blind spot) we “all” have without being aware of what that actually is; and by that I mean Joseph used that term to describe that area in our personal consciousness of which we are unaware that affects how we perceive and respond to the people and things around us and informs our thinking in ways that may be very “inaccurate”. The famous comedian; Will Rogers; had a popular saying that might be a way of thinking about how our shadow for instance activates our blind spot when see someone and form an opinion without actually knowing them: “I don’t like that guy over there; I need to get to know him better.” What he is talking about is this blind spot that sets up a pattern of response to an individual that will color the way they think about them which will grow until it is dispelled because it is based on a false impression or assumption that is not accurate Think about how dislike can turn into distrust and then grow into something even worse like despise and then possibly even hatred. The point being that we all have this human tendency to form impressions about things based upon “projection” that may or may not be accurate because of this blind spot; and emotions as a bridge are directly related to the way we interact with people and how we think about them and this is especially evident in what informs our dream life.

Now that’s one example of emotion and it’s affect on dreams. But what if I have deep “feelings” about something in my dreams? Feelings are directly tied to an emotional interpretation of something; and feelings can have all kinds of expressions concerning our emotional life; (especially in dreams as a window into the personal unconscious); which our dreams are showing us all the time; (except we don’t know how to read them or what they may be trying to communicate). Symbols and images and feelings charged with emotion are a language sending us a signal a dialogue is taking place in the unconscious we should be paying attention to because there is something going on that may need addressing we don’t realize or are not looking at. “But”; not all emotions or feelings have negative signals and may be quite the opposite expressing warmth or happiness or any number of other human connections to something that is being expressed in our dreams; (and they may be playing out in a sequence we don’t realize). And then there is the distinct possibility these dreams may not express what we think they do; which may or may not be related to this Blind Spot. Sometimes dreams mean nothing or have some obscure connection to something that has no real message (or) may seem inconsequential but are exposing something without us realizing there is a problem we can’t see without emotion involved in it’s expression. Also a review of recorded dreams from time to time can reveal a pattern that is taking place we don’t realize; “or” we have misinterpreted how we have originally perceived their meaning.

Now I am not an analyst; and Stephen or Shaaheda may have their own thoughts on my interpretations of this subject of which sharing them is the goal of this thread. We are all a “work-in-progress” as the saying goes; and we can all benefit. One other thing worth thinking about is “emotion” as a separate subject might be something to consider as this topic concerning “dreams” evolves and may wind up being a bit confining as we go along; but I don’t feel qualified enough to make that distinction concerning this particular thread; and Stephen as moderator would be a better judge on that. For now it seems fine since we are using emotion as a “bridge” to  inform or illustrate this idea of an inter-connection of emotion to how we interpret our dreams. But that’s the way I see this so I’ll leave it up to everyone else to decide if this rings true for them or not.

Again; thank you very much for setting this up as a separate topic Stephen.

[jamesn.]

Hello Shaheda and Stephen; after looking over what both of you have written I don’t think I could offer anything you haven’t already covered except 2 things occurred to me that refer back to what Shaheda and I talked about in another conversation.

One is if some kind of similar motif presents itself; (especially with Joseph in it; but not necessarily him but a Senex/Crone figure of some sort) which I know sounds contradictory; then I would think something’s going on under the surface trying to get your attention. Especially if a strong emotion of some sort is involved as I mentioned before in that earlier conversation.

Two; I’ve always been told that many of the dream messages often appear in a series of some kind; (usually 2 or 3 events but I don’t think that is necessarily a set rule); but the point being my understanding has been that the psyche is always in a process of becoming; and as you and Stephen were discussing Dreams reflect what’s going on: “under the hood”; so to speak in a language of symbols and Images that refer to this inner dialogue that’s taking place where the psyche is processing all the time because it doesn’t really stop while you are sleeping. In other words even though you are not fully conscious or awake your subconscious is still in play.

Joseph said something which to me is truly profound; “we are standing on a whale fishing for minnows”; which symbolizes this deep fathomless ocean we are riding on all the time concerning the inner depths of our being. This powerful deep inner mystery that is informing us all the time in this language we are constantly struggling to understand. In one metaphor he used: “it’s like a captain on the bridge of a little ship steering it across a vast ocean with all kinds of things swimming around under it that goes way down deep into the abyss of our inner being: “where the dark jewels glow”; and like this deep darkness or cave where our Shadow may be that may come in the forms of dragons or sea creatures we must deal with what represent these powerful forces. These may also represent our inner child that has pain or has been wounded in some way and is trying to get our attention; but Joseph also states; or at least in the way I understand it; that these forces must be interpreted or assimilated and they often come to us in the form of our dream life.

Now Stephen may have a different interpretation of this as he has been keeping dream journals for many years and is much more informed about this process than I am; but what I’m saying is that there may something from your past by way of an experience or a message from a dream that is seeking to be understood (or expressed) by the Self.

Now you may already be interpreting your dream from an entirely different perspective and I am not you nor do I mean to suggest my thoughts are necessarily relative to your particular experiences; but every now and then something will grab my attention in my dreams; (I’ll try and scribble something down upon waking); and often think about how it relates to my past experiences or something in the present I may be dealing with that my interior is concerned with in some way; which may be either positive or negative depending on the particular context surrounding it; (if that makes sense).

One last thought occurred to me is (age) may also play a part in this dream-like presentation we experience every night to where one is located within the course of their life. By that I mean in the early stages of life as Joseph mentions; the individual is concerned with achievement of life; (which is referring to having or achieving a career, raising a family, establishing a sense of self-identity, and taking care of the responsibilities that all these things require. But in the later stages of life the mental and emotional focus of the individual begins to shift towards the realization of the later stages which include acceptance and decline and loss of power of that life you have achieved. In other words it may have to do with retirement or legacy concerns or any number of other issues that later life presents that may inter this dream world as well. (In Jungian terms metaphorically speaking; he has often referred to this as the: “Grand Egress or Exit”.)

But without drifting too far away from your particular Dream concerning an encounter with Joseph and what it may symbolize for your future; (which you mentioned earlier); these are just some random thoughts that occurred to me that may have some sort of relevance later in the future; because I’m looking at this from an entirely different window and can only guess or speculate their meaning to a larger context you are contemplating. I hope this is not “clear as mud” as the saying goes; but these were my impressions considering what little I know about this huge subject which I am only beginning to understand myself. That’s about as far as I can offer at the moment.

Hopefully others will join in on this very important topic and will have something more insightful to offer on this than I have.

Namaste

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(Addendum):

Although this clip of Joseph and Bill Moyers from: “The Power of Myth”; may not directly address Dreams specifically it does address the aspect to which Dreams are related concerning the life processes I was referring to that inform the consciousness surrounding it. Hopefully this will better explain the point that I was attempting to illustrate here.

[jamesn.]

Shaaheda; yes; “What is ticking inside them”; because this represents the modern dilemma surrounding having a “Personal Myth”. It gives you something to navigate with within a social structure that is without a myth of it’s own. This is what Joseph is talking about in the Hero’s Journey.

[jamesn.]

Dennis; you are incredibly kind to say that and I’m wondering if when you have a free moment you might share some of your thoughts about the creative process. People have such a difficult time finding their place in life; finding the thing that takes them where they feel they need to go. Joseph Campbell had much to say about this but often I think the world reflects outer value instead of inner meaning. They look around and think to themselves their life has to have fame or notoriety; something that mirrors that what they “do” is who they are; when persona isn’t necessarily the true reflection of what is looking back at them. That what moves them internally isn’t necessarily the accurate picture of what is going on under the surface.

Your book dives deep into this introspective assimilation to recognize the many faces of the (S)elf archetype which is informing the ego/self/hero of what is happening on the outer conscious plane that isn’t always what the inner subconscious of the individual needs or wants. Joseph talks about the arc-of-life process as it evolves and how the inevitable change from youth through the various stages is going to affect how someone sees themselves and what drives them will start to change as they age. So that when we write within this self-reflective process our awareness will be affected also. I love how your book goes down into the depths of these various dimensions and asks the individual to explore them as they process their own inner world. Can you share some of your thoughts on this in how it has affected your own life and Journey?

For instance after waking from dreaming last night I remember James Hillman use to talk about waking: “to” the night instead of from; (his emphasis on the aging process changing how our inner focus and alchemy is now changing it’s calling); so that the things one is concerned with are looking backward as well as forward; (Janus principle); and negotiating where it wants to go next because now the life journey is considering it’s trajectory toward death and the legacy of what will be left behind begins to enter the picture. The first half of life is focused on achievement as a vehicle of expression; the self-responsible individual has achieved life and all these inner dynamics are shifting and wondering where to go next. So that as we journal or explore these feelings at whatever life stage we find ourselves how do you think about these things and the way you process your feelings as a writer? We use writing as a vehicle to explore but I think sometimes it’s the things we’ve already done or experienced that give us clues where we are instead of looking outward for new horizons.

Yesterday and last night I was captivated by the story behind the making of: “Dances With Wolves”; and now coming up for public view on PBS is the biography documentary on Ernest Hemingway by Ken Burns. Both of these projects go deep into huge themes that reflect the life process; and Joseph reminds us that no matter what the Journey or what it entails the alchemy involved to bring it forth isn’t necessarily what it appears. The end game of the endeavor is a reflection of something deeper and these are some of the things you write about in helping the individual to discover as Joseph said to Bill Moyers in “The Power of Myth” of: (what is ticking in them). Hope this makes sense. Thank you again for sharing your time with us.

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(Addendum: Sorry my humble apologies; but I missed you prior entry and you may be winding up this truly wonderful MythBlast . If time is running short and you have other things that need attending we can certainly pick this up another time. If so thank you for sharing these truly delightful moments with us; and will look forward to when you can return.)

[jamesn.]

Dennis; it is just wonderful to have you here. Concerning your thoughts about the Spiral and Dante’ it occurred to me that the Labyrinth motif that was utilized on the floor in so many of the Gothic Cathedrals; (i.e. some of my links); that this meditative symbol had much to do with one’s internal journey; (much like the spiritual pilgrimages undertaken throughout Europe); that was symbolized in much this same way.

Although this was rather clumsily described on my part; I recall in another video podcast of yours a panel discussion you had with several other people describing a kind of spiritual journey you undertook in New Mexico I think it was to different locations like a monk or an individual would travel on a trip to the Holy Land; but “internally’ if that makes sense. In other words when walking the Labyrinth in the Cathedral you were internally evoking this quest of spiritual awakening or transformation. And your shared “reflective” insights with the other members was so informative of how one might invoke their own “meditations” of their individual personal myth in everyday life; just like in your (W)riting rituals. The devotee or monk or individual is internally or meditatively traveling this same road in everything they do as a meditation to the wonder of their own life; even though it includes the Opera that hurts or Ouroboros of life eating life. Joyful sorrow/ sorrowful joy participation of life as is and must be. Rubbing the prayer beads of our own life as we circle down through the Spiral through our own: “House of Mirrors” to meet our Minotaur and listen to what he has to tell us about who we are.

I loved what Joseph recalled in “The Power of Myth” where he recounts the story of the policeman who risked his life to save an individual from committing suicide by grabbing him by the legs as he was about to jump off a bridge. When another policeman grabbed them both and pulled them up to safety he was asked why he did not let go knowing he was about to be pulled to his own death. His response Joseph recounted was: “If I had let go I could not have lived another day of my life.” Joseph revealed this was a one pointed meditation of realization: “that you and the other (are) one”.

It seems this is what your referring to in these spiritual themes one might contemplate while walking or writing or meditating or whatever they are doing while going about the daily tasks of living seem to be symbolized by this psychological  focus Joseph is pointing out; this: “thou art that”; this journey the everyday hero of us all as we stand on the corner waiting for the light to change while watching “Beauty and the Beast” or any number of manifestations of our mythic landscape while trying to figure out who we are and what is our next step we must take to get there.

Please forgive these all too elaborate descriptions; but your book has been such a joy in conjuring up so many of these themes as I sit each day with pen in hand in amazement with what comes out.  Thank you for this gift!

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